Dr. Jeff Masters' WunderBlog

Jacksonville low keeps on spinning
Posted by: Dr. Jeff Masters, 01:46 PM GMT am 19. August 2006 +1
The persistent low pressure system about 50 miles east of Jacksonville Florida continues to kick up heavy thunderstorms and high winds over the waters off the Florida coast. Wind shear from a protuberance of the jet stream is still a very hefty 40-50 knots, and is expected to remain over 40 knots through Sunday, so development of this system into a tropical depression is not expected. However, radar animations out of Jacksonville, FL show a healthy circulation and some strong thunderstorms on the east and south sides. Wind speeds at a buoy 45 miles east-northeast of St. Augustine have been about 25 mph gusting to 30 mph this morning. A QuikSCAT satellite pass at 7:06am EDT this morning showed some wind gusts as high as 45 mph in some of the thunderstorms. The low could affect Georgia and northern Florida today and Sunday much as a tropical depression would, bringing heavy thunderstorms and gusty winds.


Figure 1. Current radar out of Jacksonville, FL.


Figure 2. Preliminary models tracks for the East Coast disturbance.

Elsewhere in the tropics
The strong tropical wave south of the Cape Verde Islands that the GFS model had been developing into a hurricane is now pretty ordinary looking. The GFS no longer develops this wave. A good general rule for model predictions of tropical storm formation:

1) If two or more of the reliable models (GFS, NOGAPS, GFDL, UKMET) are forecasting develoment, watch out.

2) If none of the reliable models are forecasting development, watch out. The models miss most tropical storm development.

3) If just one of the reliable models is forecasting development, you can probably discount it.

That being said, we have a case where two reliable models--the GFS and NOGAPS--are forecasting that the large tropical wave that will move off Africa Sunday will develop into a tropical storm by the middle of next week. However, the wave will have to contend with a large cloud of Saharan dust which has just emerged from the coast of Africa.

Wind shear remains high over the Caribbean today, but the GFS is forecasting that this will drop significantly by Wednesday, and remain very low for the ten days following. I expect at least one tropical storm will form in the Atlantic during the next seven days. One candidate might be a weak tropical wave currently in the mid-Atlantic near 11N 40W.

Jeff Masters
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1151. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:49 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
what do you mean by influence?
1152. ricderr 11:50 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
what conditions are influencing the storm right now?
Member Since: Juni 27, 2006 Posts: 626 Comments: 18069
1153. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:50 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
<10 knots of shear, high ssts, just needs to be further north, it looks just like chris so far
1154. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:51 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
actually shear has picked up to about 20knots over the past 3 hrs but its close to entering low amounts again
1155. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:52 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
actually that 20 might just be with the storm
1156. ricderr 11:53 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
ok.......the itcz isn't a factor?
Member Since: Juni 27, 2006 Posts: 626 Comments: 18069
1157. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:53 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
what do you think about this mess ricderr?
1158. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:54 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
possibility
1159. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:56 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
give me a 411 on the itcz and how it affects storms if you could please, i can see it is embedded in it but im not sure how it works
1161. WPBHurricane05 11:58 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
u all here about TS Ioke in the Central Pacific
Member Since: Juli 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 7929
1162. StoryOfTheHurricane 11:58 AM GMT am 20. August 2006    
what exactly does it do to the wave?
1164. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:00 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
so are you saying its not affecting this wave randrewl?
1166. ricderr 12:00 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Link
here's a link storm...morning rand
Member Since: Juni 27, 2006 Posts: 626 Comments: 18069
1167. Stormy2day 12:01 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Bashing the NHC for not calling things as seen on this blog is insane. I, for one, am thankful that they are a lot more cautious with storm classifications. NHC has a responsibility to people's safety and to the economy. I would rather see them NOT classify a system that is borderline and likely to cause no more than your standard tstorm wind and rain. When a system is named and a path is projected - the expense of that decision begins to add up immediately. Local and State storm preparation funds, private business expenses, rising fuel prices, tourism decline...

While there are folks on this blog that obviously know what they are talking about and the discussions do help people learn more - if the NHC used the WU guidelines for assessing storms every resident on the Gulf Coast would have spent their retirement money on high rise hurricane bunkers that they would live in until December and no one would plan a vacation to the beaches.

...get it? We can discuss the tropics without being pompous and suggesting we know better...

-stormy
Member Since: Juni 29, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 306
1168. WPBHurricane05 12:01 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
wow the ITCZ is really helping that one wave fire convection, i think once the storm is strong enough it breaks out, and dies
Member Since: Juli 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 7929
1170. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:02 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
you know its the itcz by the line of convection?
1171. ricderr 12:03 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
not a problem rnd...i'm no expert...just happens to be the wave i've been following since he came off africa..i knew a little something about it
Member Since: Juni 27, 2006 Posts: 626 Comments: 18069
1173. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:04 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Stormy keep your pants on, we're simply stating that not mentioning the fact that there are waves at those 2 particular points is ludacris
1174. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:06 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
and i think id rather have somebody tell me early and be wrong than not say anything at all and give me less time to prepare
1175. Stormy2day 12:07 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Posted By: StoryOfTheHurricane at 5:34 AM EST on August 20, 2006.
lol its their jobs to spot these things and people on this blog are right more than they are 90% of the time.


no Story - that isn't ALL you were saying.
Member Since: Juni 29, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 306
1176. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:09 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
its true, i read more intelligent insight on storms on this blog and in earlier fashion than i hear on nhc
1177. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:09 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
and i think numerous people would agree with me
1178. ricderr 12:09 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
story.....i have to agree with him....they mentioned the wave we're talking about on friday...you've been all fired up this morning...and you missed the key element....it's not a big deal....and....amateur forecasting seems to be the makeup of this blog..but i think it's all to easy to bash the nhc..and truth be told..they do a better job consistantly than here
Member Since: Juni 27, 2006 Posts: 626 Comments: 18069
1179. WPBHurricane05 12:09 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
East Atlantic
East Atlantic
Member Since: Juli 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 7929
1181. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:13 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
i never said anybody was smarter than the nhc, im just saying that play things too cautiously quite often, whether or not im right about this storm lets wait and see, keep your pants on stormy, we got a long season ahead of us
1182. WPBHurricane05 12:14 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
look at TS Ioke
Member Since: Juli 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 7929
1183. melwerle 12:15 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Oh my...we all have our panties in a bunch so early on a Sunday morning...
Member Since: Juni 28, 2006 Posts: 12 Comments: 1837
1184. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:15 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
we are all amateurs here merely guessing on which storm will flare up and which wont, its not rocket science, and its not predictable, so nhc, twc, bob from accounting, could all pick out storms pretty similarly
1185. IKE 12:15 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
The SW Caribbean blob seems to be gathering some convection.

Sorry I couldn't answer you Storm...I was away from my computer.
Member Since: Juni 9, 2005 Posts: 23 Comments: 37044
1186. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:17 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
obviously those with training will know a little more, but its just like poker, you may be good and educated at the game, but you can still lose to an amateur quite easily
1187. ricderr 12:19 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
story....stop...i can't laugh any more...LMAO......tell me one thing befeore i pull a muscle...how old?
Member Since: Juni 27, 2006 Posts: 626 Comments: 18069
1188. putintang3 12:20 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Good Morning all storm fans, how are all of you today?
So tell me, what is going on with the Florida low? Is it still hanging on? Which way is it heading? It there still a chance for it to survive the crossing and can it get into the gulf? Put
Member Since: August 29, 2005 Posts: 2 Comments: 300
1189. IKE 12:20 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Posted By: IKE at 7:15 AM CDT on August 20, 2006.
The SW Caribbean blob seems to be gathering some convection.

Sorry I couldn't answer you Storm...I was away from my computer.


I meant to say...Sorry I couldn't answer you StoryOfTheHurricance.

Coffee hasn't kicked in yet this morning!
Member Since: Juni 9, 2005 Posts: 23 Comments: 37044
1191. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:23 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
ricderr, find me a weatherman thats right 75% of the time and ill show you someone whos full of s***
1193. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:27 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
im not trying to say amateurs know more, im just sayiing its a guessing game, its getting blown way out of context, anybody can look at a blob of thunderstorms and say thats going to form if the conditions are right, nhc just waits until they know for sure, we can do it early
1194. StoryOfTheHurricane 12:28 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
lol that would be hilarious
1195. IKE 12:28 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Randrewl....that ULL in the NW Caribbean is weakening...check the WV loop.
Member Since: Juni 9, 2005 Posts: 23 Comments: 37044
1196. Stormy2day 12:30 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
I do review the posts every morning as I enjoy reading other's insight and have learned a lot. Often something is discussed on this blog before NHC makes a mention - don't confuse that with them not being aware. They are aware, they are watching and they have a big responsibility.

This blog educates, enlightens and at times can give you a head start on information not yet released by NHC - all of that is fun for the weather enthusiast!

Sorry, didn't mean to come in here and stir anything up - I just wouldn't want lurkers to get the impression they are better off reacting to this blog vs. NHC

You all have a great day - I'm going to see if I can get the boat on the water before the rain turns this into a movie day.

-stormy
Member Since: Juni 29, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 306
1198. putintang3 12:31 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Well I just love Bob Breck, He is a very enthusiastic, Funny, and well knowledge, and very informative meteorologist. He has been known to bash the NHC many times and I do believe that he has gotten himself in trouble for many statements he has made against the NHC. It is really funny, because now when he doesn't agree with the NHC, he will bite his tongue and say, "OK I will not go there"
Member Since: August 29, 2005 Posts: 2 Comments: 300
1199. refill 12:32 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Guys take a look and tell me what you think about the CATL waveLink
1201. IKE 12:33 PM GMT am 20. August 2006    
Posted By: Randrewl at 7:31 AM CDT on August 20, 2006.
IKE...I saw that. Should be interesting in that area for sure. There's two hot spots right now and besides the CentAtl, the Western Carib is definitely interesting this morning. Gotta see how things sort out there in the next few hours.


Plus that TWD talks about a high in the southern Caribbean...that area is troublesome.
Member Since: Juni 9, 2005 Posts: 23 Comments: 37044

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About JeffMasters
Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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